Thursday, 19 July, 2007
- 19 Jul 07, 04:58 PM
By tonight鈥檚 presenter, :
No Rushn
We waited. We waited. And we waited. When the response from Russia finally came, it looked rather like the one we'd expected from day one. Putin has expelled four UK diplomats from Russia: An exact tit-for-tat retaliation for the expulsions Britain announced on Monday. So will this escalate the diplomatic tensions between Britain and Russia? And what exactly do they mean by threatening to withdraw support from the 鈥渨ar on terror鈥?
One theory suggests Russia was checking out the international reaction to Britain's moves before it responded. With a certain irony, today will mark Tony Blair's first day in the job as Middle East Envoy. One of his bosses, so to speak, in The Quartet will be Putin, no less. We鈥檒l be examining the way foreign policy is shifting under a Brown government as Foreign Secretary David Miliband launches what he's calling a 鈥渘ew diplomacy鈥.
Weed
It's a funny old thing, cannabis. One day politicians can't deny their drug taking adamantly enough. The next, they're all leaping on the bandwagon of admission in a 鈥渕e too鈥 spirit. Jacqui Smith, our Home Secretary, admitted she smoked it at university. Now the Chancellor Alistair Darling - once labelled the most boring man in politics - has forced us to let our minds run wild imagining him, spliff tightly rolled, little finger lightly lifted, taking a good ole drag.
So tonight we're asking, does anyone really care any more? Would you admit past demeanours if you were now in a job of substance? Which euphemism would you employ to come clean? We'll talk to Tim Yeo from the Conservatives who refreshingly admitted he took it and enjoyed it.
By-election
We'll have the latest from Michael Crick at the hotly-contested Ealing Southall by-election, and from the count in Sedgefield - both are key tests for all three main parties.
Cage fighting
And... fear not. We are onto the fastest growing sport - allegedly - in the world. It involves two men and a cage. And it looks fairly brutal. One practitioner we talk to is a preacher. Maybe the prayers come in handy. And in the spirit of Newsnight, our Culture Correspondent Steve Smith widens the niche market to ask Steven Berkoff why he's so attracted to the pastime of punching another's lights out. He claims Ian McKellan, Michael Gambon and other stalwarts of the stage are limbering up to join him. He's joking. We think.
Comments Post your comment
I hope that the reporters and interviewers involved in the Cannabis and Cabinet ministers item on tonight's programme will first say whether they have ever used the weed.
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Cage fighting is the latest craze? Really? I must have been dreaming when I first heard about the UFC in 1993.
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Ok, i was looking for a place to post comments on the recent comments by Gordon Brown that he wants to reverse the laws on cannabis, he wants to move it back up to class B again, supposedly because of more potent strains of Cannabis such as "skunk". I am 17 years old and growing up in London, naturaly i know what kind of drugs there are available. This would in my opinion be a bad idea. It will waste alot of police time and resources not to mention adding to the problem of overcrowded prisons. The use of cannabis will be moved to class B while the more dangerous drug 'alcohol' is legal. Surely the government has its priorities messed up? Alcohol leads to street voilence, vandalism, disturbance of the peace, trips to the hospitol to spend nhs money, trips to the cells to spend a night with the officers. Whereas cannabis does not make you loud and aggresive, it is much less likely to cause any kind of voilent problems or self harm (in the form of falling or hurting oneself through inability to act in a normal manor e.g. being drunk and falling over). Surely it would be a better decision for the Government to keep Cannabis as a class C drug or even take the legalisation route, (with strict regulations, over 18's only, maximum purchase allowed, specific areas to smoke, etc etc) this would make drug dealers redundant and generate a revenue for the government in the form of taxes on the product. I'm not saying that legalisation is the answer, but it is an option. I think moving the classification to class B is a big mistake and a step in the wrong direction. I also think that the youth of today are much more drug aware than people think and votes will slide away from Labour should they choose to inforce this. I would also like to see reports with actual evidence (in depth studies) that cannabis CAUSES* lasting mental health problems.
I believe that the freedom of people in the UK is being slowly taken away, smoking ban, moving cannabis up to class B, raising the age of smoking.. how long before we are a police state? Gordan Brown will not last long and regardless of my original plan to vote labour when i turn 18, i will most definatly not be.
Callum.
*causes the problems doesnt bring up underlying mental health problems.
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Re Cage Fighting
Unfortunately I can see this piece turning into another opportunity for the 成人论坛 to use more sensationalist statements such as describing Mixed Martial Arts (to give the sport its proper name) as 鈥淔ist fighting in a cage鈥 (taken from 成人论坛 radio 1 website), and to give publicity to London Assembly member Bob Blackman, who reading some of his quotes seems to have done little research on the sport & seems intent on becoming the Britain鈥檚 answer to US senator John McCain.
Bob Blackman has previously stated "The 'sport' of cage fighting offers no protection to its participants and it excites the worst sides of human emotion in those who watch it." and has described MMA, as " a medieval human blood sport has no place in modern Britain鈥 Mr Blackman should refer to to see the amount of rules and regulations in place to protect the fighters. Also surely the statements 鈥渁 medieval human blood sport has no place in modern Britain", 鈥渆xcites the worst sides of human emotion in those who watch it鈥, "I'm a libertarian. What two grown men choose to do to each other is their own affair, but I'm concerned that cage fighting glorifies violence鈥 and finally "It's only a few steps away from the gladiatorial contests of Ancient Rome." could be used to describe one of Britain鈥檚 most popular sports Boxing, which is surely as much of a blood sport as MMA.
Also statements from Frank Warren such as "It's not a threat to boxing," he said. "It's not for me, watching a bloke kneeing another in the cobblers? (Which is against the rules by the way, and is no less common than low blows in boxing!) No thanks" and the 成人论坛 describing James "The Machine" McSweeney鈥檚 training camp and fitness regime as 鈥渉ysterically butch鈥 goes to show a lack of respect for the fighters who are among some of the most highly trained and dedicated athletes in the world.
All quotes taken from www.bbc.co.uk
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As if the 成人论坛 hadn't made enough "errors" of late... I have heard on the joy of the media grapevine today in London, from sources very close to the 成人论坛, that Newsnight could be facing the axe. Surely with the 成人论坛 asking its staff to come clean about mistakes made, this would be the biggest mistake the 成人论坛 would ever make, hindsight not required! I hope this is indeed idle gossip swirling round the media industry I work in, but Newsnight stands head and shoulders above any other current affairs offering on the multi channel platforms today alongside the Today Programme on Radio 4, and whilst I disagree with the license fee in the new television order, to date I've appeased myself with these great programmes... I don't see the 成人论坛 making many other consistent programmes of this level.
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Oh Darling, pass the joint ...
I鈥檝e just heard the news about the latest 鈥榗annabis confessions鈥 and couldn鈥檛 believe my ears. This is like John Major and his affair with Eggwina. It just doesn鈥檛 seem possible 鈥 and I鈥檓 afraid I can鈥檛 avoid the old adage: truth is stranger than fiction.
However, after ten years of nuLabour, I can鈥檛 help but get the feeling this is some kind of spin, to make Alistair Darling more 鈥榠nteresting鈥. How is it that all the other senior cabinet ministers have admitted taking weed, but not Brown? Methinks the PM鈥檚 hiding something.
More seriously, I do wish we could have some research on the claims that modern cannabis is much stronger than the weed ministers (and I) smoked at college, or this debate will yo-yo from one side to the other.
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It is great for someone like you Callum of your age to be interested in drugs and the governments policies of their use, most people seem to just copy everyone else and expect everything to be made safe for them. (Good to see not all teenagers are getting drunk every night making a nuisance of themselves) Cannabis was a class B drug for decades before it was made class C in 2004, so reclassifying it is just reversing the reclassification in 2004. The health effects of using it have been proven to cause schizophrenia and mental health problems. However, the science of how it works is now much better understood. Cannabis has 2 active substances in it. The first, called THC is the stuff that makes people schizophrenic, and see and hear things that aren't really there. The second is CBD, which is thought to have the effect of reducing the bad aspects of THC. Skunk is high in THC, and low in CBD, meaning it is highly likely to lead to mental health problems such as schizophrenia. Cannabis use is also known to cause permanent damage to the brains of developing brains of younger people, in a way that it doesn't affect older people with developed brains so much. It means that even when the person stops using the drug, they still have mental health problems for the rest of their life, unlike when someone gets drunk, they have a hangover, but only for the next day. Therefore, it is not a good idea for teenagers to use it. I am in my 20's and haven't tried it, although as a responsible citizen, I am interested to experience what people are talking about. I feel that my mind is probably still growing, and it probably isn't a good idea. I certainly think it should be restricted to over 18's only, and would discourage using it to under 21's, maybe even under 25's. In many USA states, alcohol is only legally available to over 21's, so to restrict drugs to this age does have many backers with justified reasons for doing so. America had total prohibition in the 1920's of alcohol and cannabis (the skunk variety of the day being marijuana.), although alcohol restriction has been largely reversed in most states. (although alcohol is still highly restricted in Oklahoma (maximum of 5% strength, so no spirits) and other southern states like Kansas.) America banned drugs in this way without understanding all the facts. Prohibition led to a black market, crime, and caused more problems than it was supposed to solve. Bugsy Malone is famous from this time because of prohibition. Drug education in parts of America is poor. Elvis Priestly took drug to help him sleep, and became addicted to them. He campaigned for better understanding of drugs, meeting with the president of the time, Richard Nixon, although it was his overuse of drugs that led to his early death. He certainly wasn't alone, many Americans have become victims of drug abuse through not understanding them properly. Hemp varieties of Cannabis are lower in THC and higher in CBD, so the bad side effects aren't as great. Still not a good idea to use it in large amounts though. In relation to alcohol, alcohol can lead to violence and bad behaviour, and this abuse of a drug is a serious issue. These people are drinking to excess, and so lose their control and inhibitions. However, alcohol doesn't automatically make someone an antisocial violent individual. Cannabis also doesn't automatically make someone schizophrenic or an antisocial menace. Therefore I agree with you in that cannabis should not automatically be banned, but do not think that alcohol should be banned. Drugs can be abused, and some people use them excessively for an effect that is not good for themselves or others. Therefore I think that all drugs available should be safe, and also through licensed sources. Alcohol is available from licensed premises (ie pubs) so that the landlords have to supply alcohol responsibly to people, otherwise they will lose their license. If Cannabis was licensed, the dealers/suppliers would have to be responsible to keep their license. Maybe licensed pubs should have to be more responsible about who they serve drinks to. It is also true that drugs can also be available from chemists, and many of these have to be prescribed by a doctor. The drug user then becomes a patient who is supported by the doctor for advice. Some people consider cannabis a very effective herbal drug, partly because like many herbal medicines, used as an alternative to conventional pain killing drugs, for people with health problems such as arthritis, it has fewer side effects. Maybe herbal medicines including cannabis should be better regulated in this way, with licensed practitioners, who have to be responsible to keep their license. Maybe cannabis should be a prescription drug, so that users get the support of trained medical staff. I think that drug education is vital to ensure people are responsible users of drugs, so that they know how to use them safely, and so don't have problems with the bad effects later on of using them. If people can be responsible users of alcohol and cannabis, why not make it safely available to them from licensed sources. I am sure you are a responsible person, and it is nice to hear from someone who sees drug abuse as a problem, in contrast to many irresponsible people abusing drugs such as alcohol, cannabis, and others. I'm glad to see the new generation sees that they have a voice, a vote, and a responsibility.
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Having just read the 'Cage Fighting' article on your website I'm dreading the report tonight. It is so one sided and ignorant of facts, it made me depressed to read it. As someone who practices judo and bjj I know the skill MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) athletes possess, something you have completely dismissed as barbaric. I also know the type of people who watch MMA, it is not about 'babrarism' or 'bloodlust' its about skill and appreciating athletes courage.
I remember years ago a debate on your programme about boxing that had Colin Macmillan on it and having exactly the same feelings. Its the chattering classes with nothing better to do than look down their noses at something they don't understand. If you were genuinely bothered about public health ban point to point horse racing or rock climbing, they have a the highest injury/death rates of any sports - maybe they are safe though, because posh people do them.
Check out a genuinely technical and skillful fight from a couple of days ago - the finish is pure technique
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Is Jacqui Smith Gordon鈥檚 鈥淭wo Jags鈥? At least Prezza made a good fist of being consummately naughty. Jacqui鈥檚 disclosure ranks, in good judgement terms, with her display of 鈥渄ispatch box cleavage鈥 to an already angry Muslim population after the abortive bombing. As for her visceral connection to any understanding of crime 鈥 a predominantly male preserve and testosterone fuelled 鈥 nice one Gordo!
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Cage Fighting
What a bizarre report!
Those participating are exceedingly fit - and skilled. Frequently they are achievers in other martial arts. The contest is conducted in a sporting manner; fully refereed, medically supervised. Why repeat the point that "you may be surprised, but this is legal in the UK"? On what grounds would it be banned, unless every contact sport is banned?
The sport may have more `show' than boxing, but is demonstrably safer: a point made, but quickly dismissed. The repeated blows of boxing simply are not present.
If it offends middle-class sensibilities, I don't really care. I'm a convert/fan!
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BOARD GAME DIPLOMACY
There could be no better illustration that politics is a board game played by the falsely elevated, using the rest of us as 鈥減ieces鈥, than the petulant removal by each side, of four of the other鈥檚. And the terrible truth is that they cannot see how pathetic this game is. Miliband spouts all the right sound bites. Putin says business as usual, and we pawns watch the whole charade in impotence and dejection. If a this is how a country, claiming to be civilised, deals with problems (when not bombing the proverbial out of 鈥渢hem鈥) I would not want to be around when two UNcivilised countries fall out.
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Cage Fighting
I feel I have been deceived again as I believed that the 成人论坛 News department did something called 'research'.
I cannot believe that such a biased piece of journalism was aired.
I am saddened to call myself an ex-成人论坛 colleague.
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CAGE FIGHTING I suspect it is no accident that the Far East brought forth both 鈥減hilosophical religion鈥 and non-injurious martial arts. We have dogma-based religion and bloody-nose brawling. Surely civilisation can only be based on the former?
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Re barrie singleton's post
'Non-injurous martial arts' which would be? Think a little about why they were developed. A sporting environment is a lot less 'injurous.'
As for MMA (Cage Fiighting if you prefer) it is huge in the Far East. Athletes are mainstream celebrities and are on TV advertising everything from beer, toothpaste, cars, cereal, take your pick.
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Weed. weed. Sounds like Bill and Ben or should that be Bull and Bin?
Just one spliff can permanently adversely affect your judgement, apparently.
QED
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Cage fighting get with the times!!!! Newsnight get some info from 成人论坛 News. Actually do some research and get more info.
Hardly any rules: I don't think so!
Rules: Cage Rage -
UFC -
As for Frank Warren's comments....laughable. Knees to the groin are not allowed Mr Warren get you facts right. Also how long has boxing been around......of course people are going to remember he champs of yester-year because it has been around for ages!!!! There will come a time when people will remember MMA champs of yester-year as well. So be ready.
MMA practioners are athletes the compete in a sport......get it a SPORT! Referees and medical staff are on hand so why should we be suprised it is legal? If you don't like the sport then switch off or get educated in it.
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The article on cage fighting was one of the funniest things I've read in a long time (and I occasionally read the Daily Mail! It's free at my gym). The person who wrote it should be genuinely ashamed of their lack of journalistic talent and their one eyed view of a sport they clearly do not understand in the slightest. What's next on the agenda? Exposing inappropriate touching in rugby scrums? It was like reading a mock newspaper report in Viz.
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BREAKING NEWS - SO WHO IS GUILTY, AND OF WHAT?
I am angry, very angry. But this time my anger is not directed at some politician. It is, instead, directed at those who have recently decided they have an unelected right to determine how our country is governed. In recent times it has most often been the media who have assumed the mantle of the 鈥榦fficial鈥 opposition to the government. This is perhaps understandable where the Conservatives have long forfeited that role. Indeed, last night鈥檚 election results showed just how dramatically even Mr Cameron鈥檚 honeymoon has failed. The Conservatives are now on the way back to the doghouse they have inhabited for more than a decade; and no doubt their most ardent supporters felt someone else should take up the challenge of opposition.
But this time I am not just angry at the media, even the Mail, who publicly try the reputations of members of government; with very little in the way of facts, but a great deal on innuendo, and no justice. No. This time I am angry at the police and CPS, who 鈥 if they cannot be trusted to be impartial 鈥 are on a course to set themselves above the law they are supposed to uphold.
There was never any doubt that the ethics of using loans as a means of bypassing the electoral laws was suspect; and the behaviour of the two main parties was equally reprehensible. However, it was very soon equally evident that nothing illegal had taken place. Even the police effectively admitted this after a few weeks of searching high and low for guilty parties.
So what actions did the police, who only had been invited to investigate by a politically motivated SNP MP, then take?
Like a dog gnawing at a bare bone, in a dramatic series of fishing trips they spent 16 months 鈥 where 16 days should have been enough for such an investigation - looking for any charge they could level at someone; anyone, and on any subject. Of course they soon resorted to their favourite, 鈥榗onspiracy to pervert the course of justice鈥, a charge they used very effectively to raise the level of punishment handed out to Jeffrey Archer; and a charge that in theory can carry a life sentence for a white lie.
With this excuse the police, unnecessarily and without due cause (as the outcome has demonstrated), arrested three perfectly respectable individuals; one in a dawn raid which would have been spectacular even if the target had been a bank robber or terrorist. In pursuit of whatever their obsessions drove them to, they undertook literally hundreds of interviews, often repeated in the glare of publicity, and trawled through thousands of documents. If the leaks are to be believed, they found just one email which showed two of those arrested discussing their recollections of what had happened. Equivocal evidence at best, this was something we probably would all have done, in order to clarify our memories.
However, the real problem 鈥 and the real illegality 鈥 was the 鈥榣eaks鈥. Where these were universally damaging to the reputation of the individuals under investigation and the government to which they belonged, it seems common sense that these leaks most likely came from the police or CPS. As such they were criminal acts by the officers undertaking them. Yet the police show no signs of starting any investigation of such corruption within their own ranks.
The only conclusion I can reasonably come to is that the whole process, from its drawn out fishing trips to its unjustifiable intimidation of witnesses to 鈥 in particular- its orchestrated campaign of leaks, was politically motivated; designed to be as damaging as possible to the government. As such, indeed, it was a great success; proving to be the most damaging blot on the reputation of a prime minister to prided himself on his honesty. So what motivated the conspirators?
It is possible that, like the Mail, they were Conservative supporters who were desperate to undermine the ascendency of New Labour. After all, members of MI5 similarly conspired to undermine the earlier government of Harold Wilson.
It is equally possible that this was about the careers of those involved on the police/CPS side. No doubt, especially remembering what happened in the case of Jeffrey Archer, those officers saw this investigation as a juicy plum which would put them on the front pages and set in motion a progress to much higher positions. Of course, the downside 鈥 when they realized that there was really nothing to be found 鈥 was that they became increasingly desperate that the reverse might come true; that their careers might be wrecked.
I tend to favour the latter explanation, since the increasingly extended timescales seems to point to officers desperately searching for minutiae in the small print 鈥 rather than justice 鈥 needed to give them an excuse for their behaviour. In the event they clearly still found nothing and the final result 鈥 once more leaked at the most expeditious time 鈥 was clouded by the 鈥榠nsufficient evidence鈥 tag; which enabled their friends to spin out the innuendos about other forms of 鈥榞uilt鈥 rather than the truth 鈥 which was that those charged were innocent.
I believe that a government enquiry into what happened would be a sledgehammer to crack a nut, though that was pretty much what the original investigation was. However, it would seem only right that the police should investigate those within their own ranks who so clearly have broken a range of laws. Let us see, by how seriously such an investigation is taken, just how far up their ranks the conspiracy reached!
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Last night's programme was wrecked by an appalling performance by Peter Marshall. The British Foreign Secretary is entitled to some respect and when he addresses a reputable think-tank even if you don't support everything he says he is entitled to a courteous hearing and no d--- silly questions shouted across a room from a representative of our national broadcaster who seems to have left his manners in security. Milliband's stance on Russia is backed 100% by [a] the oppostion [b] the US and [c] the EU so it beggars belief why the 成人论坛 should seek to create its own foreign policy which presumably wants the government to let actions like murder on being committed on our own soil go unpunished. Remember as Birt pointed out in the Times 10 years ago that Milliband having stood for election has democratic legitimacy which journalists do not. This is not a party political, I wouldn't vote labour if they offered me a peerage and am no admirer of Chatham House whose pathological enthusiasm for the EU is rivalled only in the 成人论坛 television centre but a little respect is due.
As for Emily, I'm a fan because her style is different from the 'gang of three'. Don't put your head in the lion's mouth, ma'm. You never recovered from the opening salvo from Bolton who refuses the label 'neo con' saying he's always been a conservative: this info is accessible on the internet in 30 seconds. You do have researchers don't you?
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The 'cage fighting' report was one of the most ill-researched peices I've ever seen on Newsnight.
Haven't you people heard of the UFC? The people who invented the sport and are the worldwide leader in the sport of mixed martial arts?
How on Earth did you people get it so wrong? If you can't get combat sport right - how on Earth can I trust to you get important issues like the War in Iraq and climate chance spot on?
And why does Frank Warren - a man who promotes rapists and ear-biters like Mike Tyson - get to make stupid claims about MMA fighters headbutting and kneeing each other in the balls and not be challenged?
Pathetic, 成人论坛. Shame on you.
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First off, the term, 鈥渃age fighting鈥 is a misnomer. It might be used in many articles about Mixed Martial Arts but the fact is that many organisations use a ring. Fedor Emelianenko, who has spent the majority of his career under contract to Japanese organisations, is the greatest heavyweight MMA fighter currently active. He's, probably, the greatest MMA fighter who has ever lived. He has never fought in a cage.
The thing is, though, in a sport that utilises the combination of grappling and striking that MMA does the cage is safer than a ring. The reason is that you can鈥檛 fall out of a cage.
I鈥檓 not arguing that anyone should like MMA. People are entitled to their own opinions. What annoys me is when people who don鈥檛 understand the sport dismiss it as a joke that is akin to a bar fight or liken it to gladiators fighting in the coliseum.
The reporter in question, I apologise but I can鈥檛 recall his name, came to piece with many preconceived notions, and it was quite clear that he simply didn鈥檛 understand the sport. A few days ago Mike Chiappetta, on NBCSports.com, wrote a very eloquent piece on MMA entitled, 鈥淪port, not savagery鈥. I find it a pity that the reporter in question hadn鈥檛 read it prior to producing his report.
For those who wish to read it can be found at the link below.
Some people like motor racing for the crashes. Some people like boxing for the vicious knockouts. Yes, it is true that some fans go to MMA events simply to see what they think will be a blood bath. To infer, though, that is the sole reason people follow the sport is simply insulting. At the recent sell-out UFC show in Manchester the crowd very much enjoyed the groundwork and seemed to understand many of the nuances of position etc.
Also, cage fighting is legal. Emliy Mathers seemed surprised by this. The report interviewed a doctor who said that he hadn鈥檛 seen any major injuries. However the doctor then noted that he hadn鈥檛 been involved with the sport that long. What the report didn鈥檛 mention was the study by John Hopkins University, based on six years worth of data provided by the Nevada State Athletic Commission, that found that, in terms of brain injuries, MMA is much safer that both boxing and kickboxing. The same study did show that the rate of joint injuries in MMA is higher than in boxing. To put that in perspective though there are less joint injuries per capita in MMA than in the NFL.
The elements that essentially make up MMA are all sports. Boxing is a sport, kickboxing is a sport, amateur wrestling is a sport, judo is a sport, and Brazilian jujitsu is a sport. If all the elements that make up MMA are sports then how, when combined, can the finished product not be a sport?
In fact, a lot of MMA fighters are highly decorated practitioners of various martial arts and Olympic sports.
There are MMA fighters active who have won Olympic medals. For instance Matt Lindland, one of the top 185 lber fighters in the world, won a sliver medal in Greco-Roman wrestling at the 2000 Olympics. On September 8th the UFC hold a show in London. The main event on that show is Quentin 鈥淩ampage鈥 Jackson taking on Dan 鈥淗ollywood鈥 Henderson. Dan Henderson has twice been on the US Olympic team for the sport of amateur wrestling (in 鈥92 and 鈥96).
In fact, Henderson鈥檚 wrestling credentials can be viewed at the link below.
Lindland鈥檚 can viewed at the link below.
Top level MMA is filled with champion wrestlers. There are also world-class kickboxers. There are world-class Brazilian jujitsu black belts. There are top of the line submission grapplers. There are high level judokas. There are people with athletic backgrounds that no one would question the legitimacy of. However when individuals like Matt Lindland find a professional outlet that lets them both utilise skills that they have spent their life perfecting and, also, learn new skills then it is decried as barbaric and somehow less than sport.
MMA is a growing sport. In 2006 the UFC鈥檚 PPV headlined by Tito Ortiz taking on Chuck Liddell did over a million buys on PPV and was the biggest PPV of any kind held that year in the United States. ESPN now cover the UFC weigh ins live. Showtime, the premium cable network, have launched an MMA promotion along with Gary Shaw, a boxing promoter who promoted the Lewis/Tyson fight.
MMA is also big in Japan. In 2002 a combined show put on by K-1 and Pride FC drew 71,000 fans to the Tokyo National Stadium. 鈥淐age Rage鈥 in the UK has enjoyed tremendous growth over the past few years. Billing MMA as the fastest growing sport in the world is debatable but it鈥檚 not, as the reporter seemed to think, utterly ridiculous.
To steal a line from the NBC piece I linked to earlier.
"just because you don't understand the complexity of the gogoplata doesn't mean it's not a thing of beauty."
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As a fan of MMA, i was disgusted by your ignorant report last night. This is the second time that the bbc have erroneously reported on mixed martial arts.
Have you guys been hiding under rocks?
Ever heard of UFC, Pride or K1?
Last night's report reeked of middle class sneering at a growing sport which the reporter didn't clearly understand or research.
Sort out the third rate journalism or we will only watch channel 4 news.
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This is a piece that "60 Minutes" did on MMA at the tail end of last year.
It provides a nice balance to the piece that, 鈥淣ewsnight鈥 aired last night.
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That piece on mma was clearly un researched and written with an agenda. Terrible reporting
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The Newsnight report and the accompanying article on this website were utterly biased, unfair and have made the 成人论坛 look ridiculous.
I've put in a formal complaint with both the 成人论坛 regulators AND all of the various regulatory commissions.
Seeing as the 成人论坛 has decided to reveal a political agenda (I remember when the Beeb was the balanced voice of truth in the media. Glory days) I guess I'll have to do what I do with all political entities: refuse funding.
I'm hoping I'll see a retraction on the 成人论坛 site and on Newsnight next week. Or you'll have just lost yourself a license fee.
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My comment above, of course, relates to the piece on the fictional sport of cage fighting, one I guess that approximates to the real sport of MMA in the same way that Quidditch does wth polo...
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I find it regrettable that the 成人论坛's piece on Mixed Martial Arts was nothing more than sensationalist tabloid journalism. I am particularly surprised that the 成人论坛 did little or no research on the sport in this segment. It was filled with the same old cliches that long term fans have heard for many years. The surprise by the 成人论坛 that the sport is legal is laughable - what exactly is in the sport that should be illegal?
I was particularly offended by Frank Warren's often repeated, never corrected comments. Would the 成人论坛 watch a politician or commentator blatantly lie and let it go unchecked? There was an inference that MMA does not feature judges or rules and an inference that MMA contests do not go to judges decision. How difficult would it have been for the reporter or other commentato to repudiate Warren's claim that bouts are ended with attacks to the groin?
Is MMA violent? Of course it is. Are all combat sports violent? Yes they are. Do people who watch MMA enjoy seeing people getting knocked unconscious? Yes, but the same can be applied to any combat sport which features striking. The tone of surprise in the reporters voice that there was skill involved was insulting to practitioners of the sport who train full time in the sport.
The 成人论坛 have a remit to inform and educate. Sadly, the reporter was ill informed and failed to educate the viewers as to what exactly MMA is.
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Three men boast to each other how tough they are. One is an electrician, one is a plumber, and one is a preacher. Finally they agree to have a contest to see who is the toughest. Each will spend as much time in a cage with a pig as he can tolerate. On the appointed hour, a huge crowd has gathered. The electrician opens the door and struts in with the pig first. Five minutes later he comes out screaming; "I can't stand it anymore I can't stand it anymore." Laughing at how weak the electrician was the plumber says he'll show him what tough is. So he goes in with the pig. Five minutes pass, ten minutes pass, then after fifteen minutes the plumber comes running out of the cage screaming; "I can't stand it anymore, I can't stand it anymore." Finally the preacher confidently goes in and starts preaching to the pig. Five minutes, pass, then ten, then an hour, then two hours until finally.....the pig comes running out of the cage screaming; "I can't stand it anymore I can't stand it anymore."
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I wish to express our great disappointment in the recent report, made for News Night, on Mixed Martial-arts Cage Fighting and its growth within popular UK culture.
Being media junkies, my partner and I are appreciators of all broadcasting companies and much of the TV programming they give rise to. For their humility, wit and balance; the 成人论坛 News team and relating shows/documentaries particularly impress us; however last night鈥檚 edition of News Night was an unwanted surprise to say the least. These qualities were missing on every level and were replaced with the sexed up, uninformed, subjectivity you would usually find oozing from the pages of a tabloid newspaper or from the screens of 鈥淪kywannabes鈥 ITV. Neither of us have ever experienced, or heard of, a 成人论坛 broadcast which was themed with such ignorance, hipocrasy and bias. How did this get airtime? And why did the supposedly neutral presenter validate this whole damning report and the fascist correspondent responsible by adding her own mournful sentiment!?!?!? We would not be writing now if she had not contributed. One report lead by one correspondent with one bee in his/her bonnet can be tolerated. But, from the obvious stance of the presenter, it seems the News Night if not the 成人论坛 News team in general have become somewhat narrow-minded.
It would be appreciated if anybody who is to be involved in the making of a report, for the 成人论坛, first educate themselves in the matter under discussion. Conclusions and points were made continually throughout the report which failed to consider, or take seriously, the obvious positive aspects of this sport. These would become more apparent if time and effort were given towards comprehensive research and a fair understanding. We appreciate that, included within the realms of Mixed Martial-arts Cage Fighting, there are values, attitudes and actions which, if taken out of context, people would appose to. I do not condone mindless violence and nor would I expect or encourage anyone else to. But there are other values, attitudes and actions which are honourable, inspirational and highly skilled. We found it hugely disappointing that even an institution such as News Night could not convey this. At all!
We look forward to your response.
Yours Sincerely
Liz and Craig.
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The article about Cage Fighting completely missed the point. Mixed martial arts is a highly technical sport that's pursued and watched by enthusiasts, not thugs. Some fights are brutal and bloody (so's rugby) but most are not, and the fighters rarely win by knockout. There are far fewer head strikes in MMA than in boxing, and competent referees will usually stop the fight within the first 2 or 3 blows to the head.
There is a significant amateur scene to the sport, in which headshots are not allowed at all. There may be few rules, but the safety of the sport cannot be assessed by the complexity of the rules. In MMA, safety is ensured by having a referee who is quick to declare the fight and thus prevent serious injury to the fighters.
It's notable there is usually a strong camaraderie between rival fighters. Whilst everyone trains to win there is usually no malicious intent - quite the reverse in fact, with very good manners and friendly behaviour the norm in the ring. It is a sport, not a bloodbath, and most decent competitors and spectators treat it as such. I regard it as vastly superior to boxing in terms of skill and safety.
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Do the 成人论坛 ever reply or respond to these posts?
I am interested to here their reaction to the public's comments regarding MMA.
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The 成人论坛 article on "cage fighting" was a great example of senationalist gutter press journalism. At a time when the 成人论坛 should be adding match reports on this sport to it's on-line sports coverage, it chooses instead to make crass uninformed comments. Thank-gods for Sky!
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A think these one sided ppl should have a closer look at the sport and see the amazing skills, and sportsman ship. yet again another articale depicting the sport to be brutal and to the death, shows how ignorant some people are.
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Due to being stateside, I didn't get to see the article on "Cage Fighting" Straight away that shows how ignorant the reporter must have been due to the sport actually being called Mixed Martial Arts.
Sounds like the usual rubbish from someone who is too small minded to do some proper research on the subject, rather than relying on their own, ill-informed view. If you don't like it, fair enough, but calling for it to be banned ??? Behave.
A couple of weeks ago, 3 pro football players died in the space of a week, Rest In Peace. Does that mean that should now be banned to?!
Finally, the only reason Frank Warren is being ignorant to the sport is because he is making no money out of it!
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Hi, I agree with most if not all of the posts on here about cage fighting a sport in which along with muay thai i participate in ....or to give it its correct form MMA (mixed martial arts and a sport that england has a champion in (mike bisping after a clean sweep across the board of many other american fighters on the reality show the ultimate fighter (on bravo). This sport has its origins in the ancient olympics under the term pankration it means "king of sports" and pankrationists were treated as such becuase it embodies all the skills of the other combat sport boxing kicking wrestling and submissions as skill mix that is very hard to master.
Last month i was in london at the O2 arena at a UFC (ultimate fighting championship) event it was the largest capacity crowd at a uk fight venue scince frank bruno beat oliver mcall years ago...this sport is already here TO STAY!!! but as usual people keep blowing on about the dangers of the sport ...FACTS: only 1 recorded fatality has occured scince the modernisation of the sport in 1993 and that was in a non sanctioned bout in russia.
statisticaly it is safer than motor sport rugby parachuting skatebording surfing and boxing put together ..it is the only complete combat sport where the fighter can submit with honour and respect to avoid injury ...and unlike boxing the moniker of "no mas" or no more ("no mas" as the legend roberto duran was named by the press and the boxing world in general becuase he could not continue in a hellish fight and retired of his own willl for safety's sake) will not follow the fighter for the rest of his life!!! there is also no standing 8 count so that a fighter can get his breath and take more of a beating for the crowds delight!!! Barbarick...i think you mean boxing ...dont you? examine the facts please before flapping the gums as the facts dont lie.
A bad unreaserched peice of ..ha so called journalism from the bbc im suprised ...start showing MMA on main stream tv and watch hom much your ratings go up..sort it out bbc sort it out you claim to be pioneers of groundbreaking tv ....money where the mouth is ..money where the mouth is!!
I come home from training bruised battered and exuasted but i come home knowing exactly who i am and what strength of charicter i have, and i have no agression left in me to take out on some poor bloke in a pub on saturday night ...and i get all that from MMA!
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awsome to see the MMA community standing up and being counted in the words of "rampage" this is the best sport we takin over......
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the negative view point taken of cage fighting is one born out of ignorance.
MMA is an incredibly skillful and technical sport which requires huge amounts of displine, self awareness and control to become a good fighter; participants need to learn to understand and control their aggression in order to participate.
the level of respect shown within the sport puts most established sports to shame with champions such as Randy Couture who is the type of role model that those in the position of societies role models (football stars, celebs etc) should learn from like humility, sportmanship and be gracious in defeat.
ofcourse the sport by its nature attracts many ignorant fans who are not there for the sport but the specatcle but as they learn more about the sport it will hopefully have a positive educational effect.
those who take the time to understand the sport and dislike it are welcome to their opinions but i have no respect for people who ignorantly dismiss it with sensationalist claims, the facts are it has a fantastic safety record and in my experience attracts and through training offers a positive guiding influence to the lives of people in society who desperately are desperately in need of one.
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MMA is barbaric and is human cockfighting Not....
its the fastest growing sport and soon bbc will be on the band wagon when it does get established as a sport
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MMA is barbaric and is human cockfighting Not....
its the fastest growing sport and soon bbc will be on the band wagon when it does get established as a sport
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