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As part of , a unique and ground-breaking season of content created and curated by Idris Elba, ’s new series, has just released on ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ iPlayer.

five by five is series of short films from new writers, featuring new and established on-screen talent working side by side. Set in London, the five standalone films feature chance encounters between characters which question identity and change perceptions.

Produced by d, Executive Produced by Idris Elba for Green Door Pictures, and and for ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Studios. The 5x5-min films are written by (Flea, Harlots), and new writers Lee Coan, Namsi Khan, and .

Can you tell us a bit about five by five and how you became involved in the project?

is five five-minute films that stand alone, but can also be watched back-to-back as one 25 minute film. I got involved because I was lucky enough to be working with on another project and he asked if I’d like to be involved in this one as well.

Idris was talking about themes that I was very interested in – looking at identity and perception and looking at those chance encounters that you have that can, you know, potentially change somebody’s outlook…or their day, at the very least.

It sounded like a great opportunity and, also, I’ve spent the last couple of years writing on other people’s shows and this was an opportunity for me to lead a group of writers and I hadn’t had that experience before, so it was a great opportunity to try something new.

What does the role of “lead writer” entail? And how did you feel about taking on that title?

It was slightly different to the normal thing you might have on a show, where you have a lead writer who has created it, written a first episode, storylined it and then, you know, you bring on other writers. With this we were certain about the themes we wanted to explore and we had an idea for the format of it, but it was much more up for grabs, in the writers' room, what was going to happen.

So it was a writers' room process?

Oh, definitely a writers' room process, yes. We got into the room, people had brought ideas, we discussed them and we, as a group of people, had to meet the challenge of creating something that would both stand alone as individual films, but would work together as one story and explore the themes and ideas we wanted to explore. So it was quite, I think, a challenging and ambitious task.

Had you done a writers' room process like that previously?

Yeah, I’ve worked in quite a few writers' rooms on the shows I’ve been on in the last few years, but I’ve never been the lead writer and it’s a slightly different role. Although, to be honest, it’s kind of a free for all once you’re in the writers' room. Everyone’s throwing ideas in.

Did you have a lot of involvement with the other writers in that process? Did you have to guide them, help them…?

I was one of the voices, I suppose, feeding back to them, as is normal in telly. There’ll be a lot of people inputting notes and saying we’ll do it this way. You’ve got script editors, producers and, at a later stage, the director all throwing ideas in and, you know, I was one of those. And hopefully one of the voices that was trying to consolidate all those notes. It’s a really difficult thing for any writer, but particularly new writers, to respond to notes, actually. There were a lot of voices feeding in and it’s a really interesting project for that. Most of the writers hadn’t had a television experience before this and they did amazingly well at dealing with that. They were so good.

Did Idris Elba have any input in the writing process?

Yes, because he had brought the original idea and he was very clear on the themes he wanted to explore, he was very involved. He came into the writers' room, he had loads of great ideas for how we could tell the stories, what kind of characters it would be interesting for us to look at, and then further down the line he was looking at scripts and inputting on that. As well as being a fantastic actor, he’s a fantastic producer. As somebody who’s directed, he’s got loads of ideas across the board, so he’s a really good person to work with.

A lot of writers say that they struggle with writing short form content and find it much easier to write a full length drama – would you agree with that?

Totally. I think writing short films is so difficult. And this, because it had a dual thing of being slightly longer as well, was just so tough. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard that expression “I apologise for the length of this letter. If I’d had more time it would have been shorter.” I think that totally sums it up really. Doing something short is so difficult.

With these films, they’re about encounters between two people and, because you’ve got five minutes, you can’t get into this person’s life or who they are as a person. It’s just about what happens, you know, in that moment between them. And it’s really hard to make something happen in five minutes between two characters. It’s an amazing discipline for us, as writers, to practise that thing of keeping action absolutely in the moment. Sometimes, in the writers' room, we’d stray off into that thing of, “Well, maybe she’s coming to this place and because of that, this is weighing on her mind…” but the audience don’t know any of that. All they care about is what does A say to B, what does B say back and what does that do to their relationship and how does that change them in some way. It’s almost like a writing exercise, you know. It’s good.

When did you first hear about the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom and what led you to submitting to our ?

I just feel like I’ve always been aware of the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom in one way or another. I was somebody who, around that time, applied for lots of stuff. Lots of stuff on the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom website and I went on to win that one.

Then I did the  which was also because of the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom and a lot of people who I met afterwards would say, “Oh, you’ve been really lucky because you’ve won a few things through the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom and that’s really launched your career.” I would say, yeah, I am definitely lucky and that has definitely launched my career, but for the two things I got somewhere on, fifty things  I didn’t get anywhere on! Or 100 things!

The brilliant thing about the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ Writersroom is that it’s a great way of bringing your work to the attention of people who can make a difference for you. I think the only bad thing about it is if applying for things and not getting anywhere is something that can knock your confidence, because it’s too easy to assume I didn’t get anywhere because I’m rubbish and that’s just not the case. It’s not a certainty that it’s not good because it didn’t win or didn’t get shortlisted. There are a million and one reasons, you know, so I would like people to know that I’ve applied for so much stuff that I’ve got nowhere on! 

For every writer that is out there working professionally, they have got a ton of rejection letters under their belt, I guarantee it. There are probably some very lucky ones who make it through without that, but they’re most definitely the exception.

How did you initially approach the transition from writing for radio, to writing for screen, or had you always been doing both?

I was writing stage plays really, when I entered the Alfred Bradley Award, but I was really keen to write for television. I’m trying to remember which came first.  I think it was that I did the short film – the iPlayer Shorts - and then around the same time I had the opportunity to write an episode of . Which I can’t recommend highly enough, actually, because the great thing about Doctors for a new writer is that you get to create the characters, you have to bring them a story and a group of characters. That is so exciting.

I did an episode of Doctors and that did well, and then I went on to another ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ show, , I wrote some episodes of that and then I went on to … All ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ shows! I have done other shows too! I do work for other broadcasters too, just so you know.

When people say that continuing dramas are just a training ground, what would you say to that sort of statement?

I would say that it’s an invaluable experience. Like any craft, you have to learn it, you know. All these shows give you a really good insight into something. Doctors is great because you’re creating characters. EastEnders is great because it’s got its own distinctive style, house style, that you have to write in. If you’re going to be a jobbing writer out there working on people’s shows, you need to be able to adopt the voice of that show. That’s a great skill to learn. I think working on continuing drama is great. I wouldn’t have got the opportunities I’ve had since if I hadn’t done that.  Also, it’s really good fun as well! 

Do you have any writing rituals? Or funny habits? 

Oh, only procrastination. Not being able to get started. And not being able to start until I’ve tidied up and had a cup of tea and had a bath and walked that cat. Or whatever else I can find. That thing of procrastinating, for me, was always about… You know, I’d have this script to write, I’d have this deadline, and really it’s the fear because once you’ve started, you’ve committed yourself. The script doesn’t exist. The script can be amazing, but if you commit yourself to write it, the script is what it is. But, actually, if you’ve got two weeks to do it and you don’t start until the second week, it’s not going to be a different script in the end. You’re just going to have spent a week worrying about it.

The more experience I’ve had, the more I’ve learnt, as well, that this stuff is so subjective. If one person doesn’t like your script or has particular notes, the next person will feel something different about it. I think it’s important not to allow those things to knock your confidence, really.

Have there ever been moments where you’ve said, actually, I’ll challenge that note, or would you always go with what’s been said? 

I think you definitely should challenge notes that you feel really strongly are not the right thing, but, you know, it’s a constant grappling with yourself of working out, “Is my response to this note because it’s not a good note? Or is my response to this note because I’m very attached to this and I’m defensive and I’ve lived with it for a long time and I can’t see it another way?”.

I think, generally, if someone is really pressing for a note, you’ve got to give them at least the benefit of trying it. I’ve never worked with any producers or script editors who’ve said, “You must do this.” It’s always been a dialogue. Collaboratively finding a way to get to the end of the process. For me, one of the most exciting things about television is how collaborative it is. For some writers, they want absolute, undiluted authorship. That’s great, I don’t think television is the right medium for those people. But if you like working with people and like an idea evolving and growing, then television’s brilliant. 

What advice would you give to new writers trying to break into TV and Radio? 

I think it’s learning to take what resonates from notes and leave the rest behind. Trying to develop a thick skin. Trying to not take rejection as a soul destroying thing. And to keep writing. The more you write the better you get. One time I was saying these kinds of things and I got kind of trolled for saying them. “Like we don’t know you have to write, Cat!” But I remember starting out and not writing that much and, kind of, just hoping that I’d get somewhere on these few bits that I did write.  But the more I write, the more I practise, the better I get.  And recycling. “I couldn’t make this happen as a stage play, let’s see if I can make it happen as a radio play.” It’s hard to invest into characters and then do nothing with them. Loads of times I’ve had stuff that didn’t happen for one reason or another and then come back in some form.