³ÉÈËÂÛ̳

I do hope Jeremy asks the question from anyone in the discussion about keeping the 'status quo' and 'let's not be too hasty guys' and in general keeping the dictator in situ whether he has an arms contract in his back pocket like the guy who was rumbled by the Independent earlier in the week....you can't trust anybody these days...

The student with no future from Paris to Cairo... Hmm, Dublin to Cairo including London and all corners UK.

I am pretty sure the Russian Revolution(s) would have failed if Marx and Co had simply sat in Red Square twittering. If Lech Walesa had started a Facebook page, sending out pokes asking people to be his friend, would he be half the man he became? This is why the Egyptian revolution has failed.

Historians and academics? That sounds really... Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Why does that conjour up images of dull self-important men in cardies and slippers smoking pipes and having intense discussions with one another about how clever they are inside their own little worlds?

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. Oops, started to drop off there again.

Come on Newsnight, you ain't selling it to us.

FORM AN ORDERLY LINE!

Watching the procession of inept politicians, line up to instruct Mubarak, I was forcibly reminded of the line of self-appointed know-alls, in the film 'Airplane' who lined up to slap and shake the hysterical passenger. Orator Obama - Didactic Dave - Billy the Spud - Hapless Hillary; do these cipher-ninnies have no sense of the ridiculous?

The term 'megaphone diplomacy' seems to have dropped out of use.

'Our correspondent Tim Whewell - who has recently returned from Cairo - will be giving us his assessment of where the revolution is now.'

As things seemed to have been, and maybe still do, move hourly, that will be a trick, even allowing for the time difference and the use of a de-mothballed SR-71.

I was looking forward more to the collective wisdom from balconies from varying floors around the square, plus of course 'sources' in 'Egypt' found via twitter whilst at the student kick-off here.

'Mark Urban will be presenting us with a lesson in how to hold a revolution'

That... will be interesting, no doubt. Does the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ run trainings like they do twitter courses?

"Paul Mason will give us his thesis on the new sociological type - the university graduate with no future - that he believes lies at the heart of the uprisings from Paris to Cairo"

'I'm a graduate and I can't get a job..init, you know what i meeean man'

Having 50 percent of UK school leavers going into further education was always madness. Labour in its twisted wisdom thought getting more kids into higher education; more grads getting pumped out of the system was a good thing..well that was a stupid policy because these kids expect, nay demand a good paying job. The competition is fierce for work of any kind. Graduates who thought they may get a good job in a nice plush office with high salaries are instead found cleaning the desks and hovering these office floors or working part time in bars. The sense of disappointment must be tremendous for these young-uns. The governing class of any society knows its a balancing act when it comes to imparting knowledge to its citizens and with thwarted expectations, an overly educated population is highly dangerous because they can turn into a nasty violent rabble and with the ability to communicate with the aid of modern technology can organize better than previous uprising. They can be at the very least, a thorn in the side of any Govt.
The USA are better prepared for such problems occurring with their populace. They keep education basic and only have a small selection of grads. Most Americans don't read books nor have any understanding of politics. They are kept entertained with sports -105 million watched Stuper Bowl last weekend - and are fed a diet of poisons in the form of additives in the food and water supply that keep the IQ level at bare minimum..not to mention the high dependency of prescription drugs that keeps the average American - and this includes the kids - fuzzy minded.
That is why the US governing class is master at controlling their populace. They already have an instant kill switch for the internet and mobile phones etc and are already shutting down dissent from many organized independent minded groups that are critical of the Obama banking cartel. The average American gets taxed to the hilt, they watched the bankers get away stealing trillions and then are left with the bill, but they are so dumb they can't see that they've been taken for a ride as they are too busy watching sports with a six-pack. They'll be no uprising in USA anytime soon...its socially engineered that way..not so in Egypt. Welcome to the Muslim Brotherhood, the fountain of everything that can be found in radical Islam. The kids might be highly educated, but not smart enough to know what they are opening doors to. And I know the news media - especially the ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳- are playing down the role of the Muslim brotherhood and are only wishing the Egyptian people well in their desire for democracy to have a chance and take hold. But it wont happen, because like the average American..the media folk are not very smart. But just for the record, i'll give you a little clue how the Egypt thing is gonna play out- and you can call me on it later if I get it wrong..its gonna go a bit pear shaped.

ATTENTION JOHNNIE FOREIGNER: ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT INTEGRITY.



Nuff sed except:

SPOILPARTYGAMES

STRAW-MAN DEBAGGED BY BRILLO - STRAW ALL OVER THE PLACE

On Daily Politics, Straw ran away, into a forest of lawyer-speak, to hide from Andrew Neil's abrasive scrubbing (with respect, if I may say so).

Honourable Straw just would not come clean on Lockerbie.

Bahh ... I'll have to read idle scrawl

A ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ reporter has returned from Egypt!? Wow! Are ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ reporters like military divisions. You have to rotate one in as you rotate one out?

Heaven help us should there be a ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ reporter gap in the Cairo Hyatt!

#6 nuff sed indeed.

Unfortunately not sed nuff on certain programs, to educate the Public to what is happening.

#2 & #4: i have a bad feeling about this as well, but lets wait and see.

#5 kevsey: are you parodying yourself? Are you arguing that its "madness" to educate young people because they then have aspirations for a better life?? And that educated people are more likely to be aware of their rights, and enter the democratic arena? You were being hyper-cynical, right?

#7: what was Neil trying to get straw to admit? That it was an unsound conviction?

NO (#10)

The Straw man was in the know, when we were coaching Ghaddafi on how to get his man back from the Scots. Having given 'assurance, but not absolute assurance' (sic) to the Americans, that Megrahi would die in prison, Straw would not admit it, to Brillo.

Just how Thick are our Stundents

Thanx 2 nulabour this countree is SKINT

not enough People in "Proper" work paying Tax cant they count

Don't tell anyone this... you me us own %80 of Banks

get A Loan of 100K, payback 20K 2 the Banks, 80 Grand is yours 2 stick in your Sky Rocket.

easy innit, there is no fee for this advice

Council Bosses on 200K plus are you people MAD!

Council management on more wedge than the pm (glad i dont pay poll tax)

i love playing my Fiddles oh such fun, it pays well 2

Its Called Having one's Cake & SCOFFing at It

Mindy. In answer to your question..no
From the perspective of any Govt, the dangers of an overpopulated educated, well informed citizenry is known and how they manage it..that's a given. I wasn't arguing for the virtues of that policy..I just happen to recognize that is what goes on.

Mindy..You wont recognize the following if your a Liberal, Socialist, lecturer, teach in a school or University or watch day time TV:

When Labour increased the student intake, they balanced the dangers of an overpopulated up-and-coming (came) post Graduate population with a less rigorous curricula to the point many Graduates are regarded as having an educational level that of an average 15yr old of the 60s - and whom was state educated. Most kids leaving school today are unaware of the robbery that they have experienced - not having their brains stretched sufficiently - but are all given prizes that are not worth the paper they are written on. Employers are then given the tedious job of bringing the said certified Graduate up to a level - which includes the known basics that escaped them whilst going through the education system -before they can set them to task proper.
Mindy, your smart but I've noticed you home into comment and key phrases too quick. You attempt to construct/deconstruct without reading a post in full context, your emotions dictate your logic.
I hope this clears up any confusion you may have had regarding my previous post. And remember the world is much bigger and complex than we can ever imagine. Getting insights and experiencing revelations can come as quite a shock. I find a cup of tea helps..green tea:)

#10 Mork

You should know full well by now that the Corporate Nazi thought police won't let any ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳ journo's go anywhere near suggesting that Megrahi was an unsound conviction. And yes I know that Newsnight once did and excellent programme on the case, but Paxo ( et al ) would appear to have deliberately blanked it out from their alleged collective memory more recently.

This is the result of successive Corporate Nazi inspired governments appeasing the eco-fascist agenda. Perhaps eventually the UK people will have the moral courage to stage a " revolution " not unlike the current one in Egypt ?

the megrahi libel libyan or not has been booted out thus saving the tax payer 40 K plus per year

how much did the farce of a court case cost

how much does a round nine milly cost

the humble Neep versus the man who thinks he's a man

in front of me is a flourishing neep and a child killing man?

which life would You/eye Spare

The Neep gives Life.....The idiot male takes Life

Choose Life which Life............2 Dead Easy for Me how about You

Just when you thought the Newsnight blog had got rid of all the spammers and settled down to a reasonable debate up pops Mr Duff and the mods do nothing, despite the fact that alleged reasonable well thought out arguments from long term regulars still get removed ?

The miltary will ultimately decide what happens in Egypt.

We know what happened with Megrahi; while Blair did the deal with Qadaffi, the Scottish Appeals Court ruled that Megrahi could appeal his sentence; Blair wanted Megrahi to be part of a prisoner exchange agreement; Heid the ba' Salmond stamped his foot and asserted-correctly - that the UK govt. could not agree to a transfer of a prisoner detained under Scots law and indeed is on the record for demanding a specific agreement from UK govt. that legally they could not include him.

Then national security trumped the various versions of law in UK; national security is UK govt area, above all devolved powers; Megrahi at his appeal might produce uncomfortable situations for UK; a deal needed to be done; Heid the ba' Salmond played the compassion card - "we Scots are such a compassionate people" - Megrahi drops his appeal and gets out.

What did people actually think would happen when Blair set the 50% school leavers to University target?
That all these teenagers would go to Oxbridge and become bankers, lawyers or brain surgeons?
Was it another of Gordy Brown's smart alex ruses to keep the unemployment figures artificially low, along with EMA?

No-one used to need a degree to be a nail-painter, a hairdresser or a nurse; but you now do.

At one and the same time a dumbing down of academia and over-engineering of vocational qualifications.

And this phlegmatic nation of disgruntled one time imperial masters sits back and lets all this piffle happen.To them.

So who's gonna raise the scarlet flag of revolution tonight?

Simon Sebag-Montefiore? I should coco.

Simon Shama says, "wave your arms in the air.."

Not so much air guitar as air Mississippi paddle steamer.

Spam spam Spam Spam Maps maps maps maps Glorious Spam Glorious Maps

Loads of old Nackers on this Sh**T Site ready for the Knackers Yard

I am Utrique Paratus but I am not Ready for That yet

Do you NO what you Eat do you where your going

HELL in A Handcart baby Rattles in2 mind

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

as if it wasnt painfully clear



you need to graduate to get a job in McDon's in usa

take away the circus and the bread
their kicking over the statues not just the pricks

LOL I did Love Simon Shama's Thrust at the Septic's

One of The ³ÉÈËÂÛ̳'s Chicks T Shirt Said .. Live Simply .. Yes, but we still
have 2 Shoot for The Stars


Is Vick there

just watching The Start of PMQ's

The 2 neddy's from ASS .. a simple stupid party (nulabour)

The Bloody MESS that ASS has left this Country in is Criminal
had enuff of ned he is a child in pampers

THE MIRACLE OF FREE SPEECH WE ACHIEVE DAILY - 'THE IMPOSSIBLE', OF BEING HEARD, WILL TAKE A LITTLE LONGER.

The beautiful irony of the word 'revolution' was all but lost on the NewsyNight ethos. 'Rebellion' would seem to fit better, at this point in the proceedings.

Meanwhile, in fool's-paradise England, the smoke, and mirror, industries look set to save the economy.

I gather Pope Tony has hailed Mubarak's 'strength and indefatigability'. That he developed his megalomaniac skills, as our prime Minister, signals just how deviant the Westminster Regime is. And now:

WE HAVE GOT OURSELVES ANOTHER ONE.

But I doubt we shall see a popular uprising; our delight will be getting caught up in inter-ghetto strife, when the misery really bites, and Detached Dave's nostrums only serve to inflame.

good news from Egypt - the first report. We ae all in hope for a better future for them.


however, cute as she was, it would have been nice a report from someone who has been "organising in the square since the beginning" who was actually *Egyptian*, not sounding so American. There were plenty of people in the earlier clips of this Egyptian Evolution who spoke good english.

the three guests after were superb. More of them, please! Although the Professor type could maybe not drown out the other speakers, no matter his message was excellent to hear. Their's was also. :)


but not the later 3, the woman again, the guy in the chair - they all sucked again.

duke guy made some good points at the end. Or started to. And again.

And the half-Egyptian woman was *definitely* cute. ;)


nice programme tonight overall, i thought. :)


ps, on the African - Chinese Chicken report, that reporter is almost always suberb, and especially so in this recent crisis in Egypt. I don't know if this recommendation will help or hinder his career more, i hope help, but the occasional error is not so bad, when the general approach is superb. As is NewsNight in general, often pushing the limits.

thanks to NewsNight for letting the Egyptian people know we care about them, and what happens to them.


...and a nice overseas win for England tonight. :)

Ah Ruddy Hell its Harry & Paul thats better

The Criminal Justice System is Bleedin You Dry

The European Court of Human Rights is Bleedin You Dry

Criminals have Far More Rights than You and I

And Leech lawyers with Attached Baggage are Bleedin you dry and not just of Money

A Drain on The Brain .. what P brain

A Public Servant is A Public Servant ( The Crown is EXempt )

middle and top management are far 2 Greedy

A Man or Woman who has A Real Talent Deserve Reward

Putting Feet on A Desk and A Shiny Arse on A Chair 2 Me is not Talent

TODAY, DEMOCRACY DAVE REAFFIRMED TORY 'NO' STANCE TO AV

Is it me, or is it fundamentally undemocratic for political parties to campaign in a referendum on voting? How we vote, transcends party politics - they should step aside. This is OUR show. Of course, such a nice point is lost on Dictatorial Dave.

Incidentally, they could so easily tack a rider on the referendum vote, for an abstention box on voting papers - so they won't, because the weasel-smear that 'voters are too idle to turn out', would be demolished, and their wholesale rejection confirmed.

SPOILPARTYGAMES

Paxman gathered together Simon Sebag Montefiore, Simon Schama and a Gigi Ibrahim, a young Egyptian activist to discuss the whys and wherefores of the EGyptian revolution, he referred to the two Simons by their full names (Simon Sebag Montefiore, a bit of mouthful as names go, by the way_) Paxman kept referring to the young, attractive Egyptian activist as simply Gigi...reminded me of his interview with Dizzy Rascal when he kept calling him Mr Rascal....and we all know who came out on top that evening...what's the matter Paxman? a bit of an unreconstructed dinosaur, are we?

I do Like that Modern Tank/bank/skank/rank/flank/yank? Shop

didnt know there were that many Clarkson's about

#14 kevsey: had you followed a link i keep posting, you might understand the answer to the question, - if our children's and students minds are not being stretched enough, what can we change in our schools and 'Places of Learning'?



if you want students who are used to behaving responsibly, then they have to learn by *having responsibility*. There is a need for very many various sills in our near future, and if income was closer to reward levels for other skills, then people would choose a profession because they wanted to do it, rather than it just paid more. And people would learn both academic and manual skills if they both were interesting enough, which most people, would probably like to.


so you might say the 'sin', or 'error of judgement' for New Labour was not the increase in numbers able to go to university, it was that the education they received was often too low a quality.

however, this is an old problem, as we can see from the poor performance of those trained in Philosophy, Politics, and Economics currently running the UK into the ground - the present bunch. On both sides. Clearly therefore education at all levels needs improving immediately - but education in general is also beneficial, not only for the individual, but also for the society, On top of which, it is cheaper for the state to subsidise someone to go to uni, than to keep them unemployed and renting, if there are no jobs. Surely its better to pay the lesser amount that pays for so many to go to college/uni, then the higher amount to keep them unemployed? The whole policy is crazy!

but if its aimed at keeping Uni study Elitist?


a more balanced economy requires a rebalancing of the 'cost' of manual labour versus intellectual (especially finance). Wages for manual and skilled manual labour need to go up, dramatically. Wages for The City, and many senior managers, need to come down.

to be honest, i'm sure there are millions of UK citizens who could be so completely inept at banking they bankrupt entire banks, and drive the UK economy into recession, as well as any of those parasites living in the ivory towers of the City. So how can they justify their incomes and bonuses please?


and as we have seen over the last year or so with the university protests, many of the Unis have managers who are not in slightest interested in giving a decent education, only maximising income. Do not blame the students, or the desire for higher education for as many as possible, for the bad education that comes of a result of garbage 'priorities' for the Govt, the last and this.

education is a valuable thing, there are people in Africa who are aghast our Govt is this doing this. To be honest, most of us are too, i think.

NEVER MIND THE 'UNRECONSTRUCTED' - FEEL THE DINOSAUR! (#31)

What do you want for that piffling salary, Papas - professionalism?

Last time I suggested that interviewing is a natural talent, like singing or acting, I was Blogdogged . . .

Hi, if the news report is correct that the saudis have offered to replace US aid to Egypt wouldnt it make sense for the US to accept this gesture and use the money elsewhere, perhaps to cover the cost of Nato peacekeepers stopping the violence in countries like the Congo? Wouldn't this be a very good use the resources that could be released by this Saudi offer?

Excellent interview with Mohamed ElBaradei tonight and also with Simon Sebag-Montifiore et al too. Bottom line - the Egyptian "revolution" is going to be another mess like the Iranian revolution, particularly as The Muslim Brotherhood is the only opposition party to Mubarak. Saudi Arabia has only OFFERED to fund Egypt in the event that the US stops funding it. Highly unlikely if you ask me!

WHAT USE IS EDUCATION IF YOU ARE SOCIALLY INEPT GOING FORWARD? (#33)

Governments purport to be at pains to improve HEALTH, WEALTH, LAW n ORDER and EDUCATION.

HEALTH: They run a sickening social regime in tandem with a National Repair Service, with emotional health neglected.

WEALTH: Nothing has changed since the Bible reported on money. It's a cultural issue, not structural.

L and O: Again - cultural. Our culture is of cheating, manipulating, lying and dog eat dog; LED FROM WESTMINSTER. Police, courts and prisons are not the answer.

EDUCATION: Schooling is not learning. It INCREASINGLY parts parents from children, hence learning TO PARENT is lost. A nation of orphans.

Westminster attracts 'the wrong kind of mentality'. Westminster takes pride in its POLITICS. Politics is not governance.

SPOILPARTYGAMES

DEMOCRATIC SCHOOLS - THEY DON'T DO PARENTING (#33)

Dave Allen, memorably, said of spiritual healers: "They don't do teeth!"
As I have recently posted: Only parenting teaches parenting. Schooling institutionalises, and democratic schooling creates institutionalised democrats? But it is not what Nature would do.

Modern, clever man, progressively breaks the tie with Nature's norms, building an ever-greater tension. Snap!

Mork - I see the probable advantage of democratic schools over Gradgrind Academies. But do they address the unnatural nature of what they do? I can find no background philosophy/credo.

What better than an on line forum to prevent people from venting on the streets?

Discuss!

WHAT BETTER THAN AN ONLINE FORUM?! (#39)

Men are easily diverted. I won't elaborate, the Blogdog is a sensitive flower. Homer Simpson is a good illustration.

As for the ladies - I could not possibly comment.

given saudi and other arab states have said they will back mubarak with billions of dollars its not looking good? Seems no one in the region wants arab 'freedom and democracy'.

Should only countries with a history of democracy have democracy?

This came over from all participating guests as a very weak format for a real revolution.

Although I wasn't really surprised that we had those who can't understand what is going on and others who didn't really have an idealistic view on where it should be going.

Far more interesting watching our own parliament today really throwing the welly at undemocratically elected judges somewhere in Europe trying to take our own democracy away from us.

It's hard to stomach but some of them are really going up in my estimation. Putting tribalism aside could really achieve something yet.

and our judges are democratically elected and party leaders sooo responsive to the thoughts of the nation; broken promise anyone?

interesting from daily politics "debate" held by prescott + priti. where he pointed out that rejection of the euro courts et-al would throw out the bill of human rights it may have been a joke but there's a grain of hard truth in it

"Should only countries with a history of democracy have democracy?"

A history of building up to democracy through cultural and institutional reforms seems to work better than a 'short sharp election' using purple dye.